Microscope for cell counts

Thu Nov 27, 2008 4:16 am

I am looking for a microscope to use for practicing cell counts, and I'm not sure of how much I actually need to spend to get one. I'm on a rather tight budget at the moment, so I was wondering if I could actually get by with a really cheap one, kind of like the ones you buy at toy stores? All I want to do is count cells, I'm not looking to culture yeasts or study bacteria and so forth. I guess I need 400x magnification, but will any cheap-ass model do?
Gahr Smith-Gahrsen, Bergen, Norway

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Re: Microscope for cell counts

Thu Nov 27, 2008 4:46 am

You're not going to need a 400X scope, they are very expensive. 40x-100x scopes aren't cheap either, but I don't think a toy microscope will do the job. Check ebay. The Hemacytometer alone will cost you a couple hundred bucks, and you still need the dye.
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Re: Microscope for cell counts

Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:26 am

Sheen wrote:You're not going to need a 400X scope, they are very expensive. 40x-100x scopes aren't cheap either, but I don't think a toy microscope will do the job. Check ebay. The Hemacytometer alone will cost you a couple hundred bucks, and you still need the dye.


Ah, one zero too many... I was able to see yeast cells in my old microscope (with 40x magnification), and that was actually bought in a toy store. Alas, it is broken now, but will the problem be that the optics just aren't of a good enough quality? The hemacytometer will probably set med back more than the microscope, but I'm trying to cut costs where I can...
Gahr Smith-Gahrsen, Bergen, Norway

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Re: Microscope for cell counts

Thu Nov 27, 2008 5:58 am

Check out the 8/12/2007 session. Chris White talks a lot about cell counts and microscopes on that episode.
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Re: Microscope for cell counts

Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:33 pm

Check your local schools and colleges for old biology equipment they may be getting rid of. There are newer and quicker methods now for counting cells than hemacytometers, and some places may be getting rid of them or at least would be willing to sell you an extra one on the cheap. Same goes for microscopes.
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Re: Microscope for cell counts

Wed Dec 03, 2008 5:45 pm

i've done hours and hours of yeast cell counts when I was a student.

you need 400X or don't even bother the trouble and expense of counting cells. With that 400X, you'll be able to see some bacteria. The yeast will look like little donuts and the bacteria looks like dust specks.

Let me know if you are still going to do it and I'll give instructions and the formula to calculate cells/mL.
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Re: Microscope for cell counts

Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:15 am

I'm definitely going to go ahead with it. When you say 400x, I suppose you mean that the ocular (eyepiece) has a 10x magnification, and the lens (or whatever you call it) has 40x? I just found out that the school where I work (I'm a teacher) actually have a few microscopes stashed away that are rarely or never used, so I can borrow one from work. I I'll have to save some money to buy the hemacytometer, but I'll definitely get one eventually. In the meantime, I guess I will just bring a paper towel and watch those yeast have sex...
I was fortunate enough to attend a lecture given by Chris White when he visited the Nøgne Ø brewery in Norway in May, so I got a little info on the counting procedure there, but I'd be grateful for any instructions you could give me, booboo!
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Re: Microscope for cell counts

Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:40 pm

in addition to having the microscope and cell counter, I think that you are going to need a very accurate way of making dilutions. There are way too many cells involved with brewing to go straight to a cell count. I'd imagine that you'd need to be able to do something like a 1:1,000,000,000 or more dilution. You don't want to do that in one step. Usually avoiding dilutions greater than 1:100 is ideal. You can accomplish large dilutions by doing "serial dilutions". Serial dilutions involve repeating the same dilution over and over again. So say you do a 1:100 dilution first. Then you mix that up well and do another 1:100 dilution. your second solution is now a 1:10,000. If you made a third 1:100 dilution, you'd be at 1:1,000,000.

Here's the thing, if you don't have the means of pipetting accurately, each 1:100 dilution is going to be off by a percentage. Each time you make that dilution for the serial dilution your percent accuracy is getting further from what you'd desire.

In our lab we had variable volume pipettors that cost about $200-$300 USD each. That way when I'd do a 1:100 dilution i can add 10uL (0.01mL) to 0.990mL with less than 0.1% error.

Here's a link to white labs for their procedure on counting cells.
http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/cell_count.html
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