First cider help

[im1dermike]

I made my first cider almost a month ago using the following recipe:

5 gallons flash pasteurized apple juice
2 lb. brown sugar
1/2 lb. raisins
1/4 cup molasses
3 cinnamon sticks
Nottingham yeast

I kept fermentation pretty cool for the first 3 weeks, around 60 degrees ambient temp. I took a gravity reading after 3 weeks and it was only at 1.030 so I moved it from my basement to my upstairs where it's warmer, also rousing the yeast. I'm going to taking a gravity reading this weekend. Once the gravity is where I want it, I'm planning on cold crashing and racking it to a secondary for like 6 months.

My concerns are 1. autolysis setting in soon since it will be on the yeast for a month this weekend and 2. the gravity will not drop enough; I've read ciders are supposed to have a FG around 1.000 and it's no where near that.

I'm assuming that when I check the gravity this weekend it will be around 1.020 and it will not yet be done. I feel like I should rack it off the yeast this weekend and pitch a new packet of Nottingham and some yeast nutrient. Can anyone give me some suggestions of what I should do? Thanks

[BDawg]

If the gravity has dropped, just leave it alone as long as you aren't smelling foul rubbery nasty stuff.

If the gravity hasn't changed or only dropped a point or so, the only thing I can think of is that while wort has plenty of yeast nutrients in it, cider/perry/mead/etc do not. Did you add any yeast nutrient to the batch? Its probably too late to add it to the batch itself, but if you are still way up there at 1.030, then possibly make a new starter with some yeast nutrient in it, and repitch that. (Consider using a fruity red wine yeast, too for that).

HTH-

[im1dermike]

Wouldn't it be too late if I started smelling "foul rubbery nasty stuff"? I want to prevent that. I want the gravity to be around 1.000 before I let it age in the secondary, right?

I did not add yeast nutrient. I was told that there would be enough nutrients in the cider and raisins that I didn't really need to add nutrient.

[numsquat]

Some thoughts and ideas:

I always add yeast nutrient to my ciders. Would recommend it in the future.

The temperature change and yeast rousing my help, the low end for Nottingham is 57F. The time on your current yeast isn't a problem yet. I've gone 6 weeks in the primary with cider with no taste problems.

What was your OG? The Nottingham may have attenuated out.

If your gravity stops (and after this fermentation it will slow down at least) I also wouldn't pitch the Nottingham again, the alcohol level will be to high for it to do much if anything. Use something like Red Star Premier Cuvee with some nutrient.

[im1dermike]

Thanks numsquat. I didn't take an OG reading. I figured it would be around 1.050 or something. It doesn't seem like the OG really matters since you're not mashing or anything, only the FG, so I didn't bother.

Adding nutrient and pitching a more alcohol-tolerant yeast makes sense to me and sounds like a plan to me. I'll give the cider another week (making 5 total: 3 weeks at ~60 degrees, 2 weeks at ~65 degrees) before I take another reading, transfer, and repitch.

Am I correct in my thinking that it should be at it's final gravity (around 1.000) before I age in secondary?

Thanks guys.

[Lars]

Hold on there turbo. Autolysis in 1 month, probably not. You'll find that autolysis in brewing is an ongoing debate. But, iirc it takes many months, not 1 month. I've let meads and ciders sit on the primary yeast for months with no problems.

Ok, now that is out of the way. Before you go adding yeast or nutrient or any of that crap, taste the cider. Quite frankly if it ferments down to 1.000 or even lower you will probably have to back sweeten it. If it tastes good now, consider yourself lucky!

[im1dermike]

I have no idea how a fermenting cider (and actually any cider for that matter - I've only had Woodchuck and Strongbow ) is supposed to taste, but when I tasted it at 1.030 last weekend, it tasted like slightly alcoholic apple juice that was a little sour.

[BrewTa2]

Let's say that the apple juice had a SG of 1.050. The added sugars would easily make the OG in the 1.070 range minimum. A 77% yeast attenuation puts you at about 1.016. Best case with healthy yeast at a warmer fermentation temperature and nutrients in the must. Add Champagne yeast and you should be able to get the gravity down. You may want to make a starter with apple juice and nutrients so you're pitching healthy, active yeast. Like Lars said, if you do get it to 1.000 or less it'll probably be way too dry and need to be sweetened.